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  #1  
Old 05-20-2018, 02:22 PM
f33d f33d is offline
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Default Working around the randomization-limitations?

I am checking out the demo of Numerology 4 at the moment & soon stumbled upon a randomization-limit:

manual:
"In all cases, the generator algorithms only modify the parameters that are critical for the algorithm to do achieve it’s musical goals. This means that you can significantly alter the type of pattern generated by manually setting other parameters. For instance, none of the MonoNote generators currently set sequencer direction, key, octave, note quantization, skip steps, mute steps, random jump, groove, repeat or divide. In addition, none of the algorithms set the length of the sequence (or the start and end points). By settings these parameters yourself, either before or after you run the generator, you can significantly influence the results. "

the reasoning behind this is also explained this way:
"The “Rnd” (randomize) generators are all pure parameter randomizations. They vary only in the number of parameters randomized. In addition, the randomization of many parameters is limited to avoid extreme cases"

Honestly I came to Numerology in search of options for such extreme cases. I am just a sucker of randomization, probably not everybody is.

So for me at least, this just begs for a feature to create custom randomization algorithms deciding what to include/exclude yourself,
like in the Evolve-feature, but with all options & total randomization.
(Midi-Controlling min / max values of randomization would rock even more, but this is not my personal dream-land is it? )

Let me explain my problem some more:

I understand that I can randomize a certain step/function by assigning a S&H modulator e.g for note-quantization, but then I got to add sooo many running LFOs instead of simply clicking "random". Also in the Groove-Option, e.g. I'd have to add a LFO-modulator to every step of the sequencer as far as I can see. That would be alltogether >9000 S&H LFOs... & my CPU 2.9 GHz Intel Core 7 seems already busy with 4 LFOs. Not to mention managing that many LFOs. Is there an easier option? Unfortunately not many options in "evolve" either. Would be cool to see over there all the "blocked from randomization" parameters.

After digging a bit deeper I found a more elegant way than lots of S&Hs would be paramod: e.g. taking the randomized CV1 from the MonoNote through paramod into the "rnd-blocked" parameter, say, "Divide" then taking CV2 into the 2nd paramod channel to modulate the ParamIndex to get to all the steps of Divide, but this results for me somehow in mild alterations of Divide-steps, some steps even not changing at all, not sure why this is. Maybe you Numerology-Ninjas can point me to a much better workaround to find my totally randomized sequencer path?
THANKS!
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  #2  
Old 05-26-2018, 07:19 AM
f33d f33d is offline
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really nobody?
c'mon dear numerology users, any ideas?
maybe you know why modulating the paramindex + steps, by randomly generated sequences doesn't work out as "randomizing all steps" step after step?
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Old 05-26-2018, 10:36 AM
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jue jue is offline
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Hello,

Sorry but were is the limitation? Could not see your problem.
If I need a lot of modules I use them, ok it needs some work and the ideas to connect them but everything is possible. Have projects were several hundred modules are used without any problem. Think it is up to you to make your ideas possible. If you are looking for extreme cases you are free to built them.
One information if you really go extrem, some were between 500 to 500 modules the automatic connections between the modules got lost if you copy a stack but you can manually fix it.

This is not a one touch button sequenzer, its a complete Modular Step Sequencer environment.

hope this helps
best
jue
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Old 05-28-2018, 11:37 AM
jim jim is offline
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There are a few easy tricks you can do to 'expand' the randomization of a pattern.

First, of course, the the "RndAll" generator covers Pitch, Gate, Velocity, Divide (a bit), CVs 1-3 and ChPress. If you take the CV outputs and assign them to synth parameters (cutoff, attack, decay, etc), you'll be adding quite a bit of variation to a melodic line than you would get otherwise.

You can also do 'Add Modulation' and use a sequencer on parameters like Rate, Direction, Key, Scale, Octave, etc. Program the added Mod Seq with a linear or semi-random pattern and set it's direction mode to 'Random' -- have it run fast or slow, either way it will weird things up quickly. Also: randomizing sequencer rate is very similar to randomizing StepLen.

Ditto for RandJmp -- it only take a few of those to change things up.

Cheers,
Jim
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Old 05-28-2018, 01:44 PM
f33d f33d is offline
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thanks for the replies!
@jue, my problem is: "& my CPU 2.9 GHz Intel Core 7 seems already busy with 4 LFOs. "
is it really no problem for your CPU to add 200-500 LFOs? Maybe something is wrong with my computer...

@jim, yeah I jumped on RndAll as soon as I opened Numerology for the first time, but soon found out RndAll is not really RndAll

I understand, that for some parameters which are not included in RndAll I can "add Modulation", but adding a sequencer I am stuck with having to "randomly program" it time & time again which does not make sense in a performance setting when I want to randomize quickly - random direction is not really fresh randomization.... so I can add S&H LFOs, but they are heavy on CPU, but ok as jue pointed out 200 LFOs should be no problem... but what about the rest where no "add Modulation" option is available?

here is a concrete example:
how I would go about randomizing "repeat" of "mononote"?
Only (failed) solution I found I wrote about in my first post & but I try to explain it more thoroughly:
I use CV1 & CV2 of MonoNote which I can conveniently randomize with RndAll. Then I connect CV1 through ParaMod to StepRepeat (setting min to 1 - max value to 8) & additionally to reach all 16 steps of StepRepeat I connect CV2 to ParamIndex of the ParamMod (min 1 - max 16). So in theory a random value of CV1 should set the step value and the random value of CV2 sets which step out of 16, but what I actually get that step 9 jumped to value 5 & step 16 to value 6 & no any firther randomization of StepRepeat happens. I don't know why. I see that the play-direction is fwd, so no randomization of the index seems to take place... so it looks like I don't understood it correctly.
So what would be a working way to randomize parameters of MonoNote where I can't "add Modulation"? That would be:
Groove
StepLen
Repeat
Divide
Probability
RandJmp
Pitch Glide

It would be great for me to be able to perform randomization of those parameters via midi separately. It would be part of performing itself aka "playing the sequencer"... I know that I could setup a midi-controller like nano control to represent all this in a sequencer (that would be 7 sequencers for all this parameters) & set all values of respective parameters by myself, but I just love surprises & randomization. Numerology seems so close to this dream, but I can't figure out how.
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Old 05-29-2018, 12:52 AM
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jue jue is offline
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Hello,
working on a small project this morning on a MacBook Air 1,6 GHz i5,
8 Stacks with 52 Numerology and AU modules
1 Stack for reverb
resulting in a 75% CPU load.
Without the reverb the CPU goes down to 50%,
So I think there is something wrong with your Computer / AU settings.
If there is some time today I will make you complete randomized MonoNote example, you want a one button solution or do you need a always live modulation of all parameters?
best
jue
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